As I related in a post last night, I engaged in an interesting conversation with a Christian on Saturday evening. Initially, this fellow assumed that I must be a Christian because...well...isn't everybody? When he discovered that I wasn't what he thought I must be, he was a bit flummoxed, but only for a moment or two. We pick up the conversation from there.
Customer: So, you really don't believe in God?
Me: I really, really don't believe in a god, yours or anyone else's.
Customer: So, I guess that means you don't believe in anything.
Me: That's a big jump, don't you think? Just because I don't believe there is a god or a bunch of gods doesn't mean I don't have beliefs. Everybody has beliefs of one sort or another.
Customer: Okay, so what do you believe in?
Me: Lots of things. For example, I'm a Taoist.
Customer: A what?
Me: A Taoist.
Customer: What's that? I've never heard of it.
Me: Are you familiar with the terms yin and yang?
Customer: Sure. I've heard of ying and yung.
Me: No, that's yin and yang.
Customer: Okay, ying, I mean yin (?) and yang.
Me: From the Taoist perspective, yin and yang are the two opposing forces in the universe.
Customer: Oh, I get it. Yin (points upward) and yang (points downward). Those are just fancy words for good and bad, heaven and hell.
Me: No. They aren't. One isn't evil, while the other is good. They are valueless opposing forces.
Customer: What? Everything in this life has to take a side.
Me: Really? What side does a thunderstorm take?
Customer: What kind of a crazy question is that?
Me: You just said that everything in life must take a side, so I want you to tell me which side a thunderstorm takes.
Customer: (starts to walk away) Look, I need to get back on the road. I've got a schedule to keep. (Note: He is an over-the-road trucker.)
Me: Okay.
Customer: It was nice talking to you. If you don't mind, I'll say a prayer for you.
Me: Go right ahead. If it makes YOU feel better to say a prayer, then say a prayer.
Customer: Well, I won't be doing it for me; I'll do it for you.
Me: I don't need it. I don't believe as you do. The way I see it, people pray for others because it makes them feel good about themselves. It makes them feel as if they've done something proactive. So, if praying for me makes you feel good, go for it!
You: "From the Taoist perspective, yin and yang are the two opposing forces in the universe."
ReplyDeleteIt might have been better, and clearer for the trucker, if you had said "two complementary forces, always in flux." I usually demonstrate these to inquiring people, as manifestations of Tao, with a moment of cloud hands.
Otherwise it sounds like Zoroastrian or Manichean dualistic cosmology: good vs. evil, male vs. female, up vs. down; heaven vs. earth--ideas which the trucker was all too ready to grasp and take sides over.
Truckers, you would think, get Tao, but he probably spends too much time on the road with right-wing and Christian radio.
When people want to pray for me, I just smile and say "thanks." Why engage in a religious war? No need to convert him, save him or justify oneself. Let it go.
But that's my yin perspective.
My point, if it wasn't clear, is that if yin and yang are regarded as "opposing" forces, their unity in Tao, and the concept of change are not understood.
ReplyDeleteYes, that would have been a better way to approach it. I'm not the best debater or conversationalist in the world as I'm a slow and contemplative thinker. Since my social interactions are limited, I have the tendency to become tongue-tied.
ReplyDeleteI liked the thunder question.
ReplyDeleteIt's fun when they mention god to exclaim "oh! You believe in the devil!?" And use this to explain the dualistic nature and thereby the flaws in their belief.
I'd also enjoy playing dumb and bringing the tooth fairy and Santa into it. You could even ask "do you think god gave the baby superman special powers on his planet because he knew of the impending wide spread destruction and because, as Clark, he'd get bullied on earth?"
If you can play any of these lines dead pan enough they're yours as soon as they reply.
"supermans's not real you say? Fuck you heretic. I suppose you'll tell me Spiderman is a story too next but you believe in god? You're telling me god parted the sea himself without calling superman? If the best god can do is set fire to a bush in the desert and whine and moan about not being given a decent sacrifice or that Mary did not pray often enough so he gave her dog cancer.. You'd better hope that devil is not so prone to mood shifts. may superman save you!!!"
Of course, that conversation would never happen.......
Priceless, and well done.
ReplyDelete